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Post by Rob W. Case on May 25, 2020 22:23:01 GMT -6
Full Title : The Ultimate Transaction: When Freedom is Purchased with Blood
Have you ever owned something of significant value (be it monetary, sentimental, or useful in some capacity), and acted carelessly in where you placed it, how you maintained it (if even at all), and/or lost sight of the fact that in the future, there might never be anything quite like it offered again? When you really think about it, freedom is very much like that.
Whether it is through the Revolutionary War, The Civil War, World Wars 1 & 2, and/or even the more recent wars in the middle east, a transaction is always taking place, a transaction in which blood is spilled to establish, protect, and/or even preserve the immensely valuable gift of Liberty. When that gift is purchased, it is so immeasurably valuable, that it has to be handled carefully, respectfully, and with considerable caution and discipline.
The Power of Blood: Since the earliest period of human history, blood has been a particularly important and meaningful substance that has a special connection to God and other men, “for the life of all flesh is its blood” (Leviticus 17:14a). That said, when blood is shed in the moment of sacrifice, it purchases something. When men overstep their boundaries, when laws or other matters of sovereign importance disregard, disrespect, and/or impose an insatiable control over us, and others in this country, there is a burning yearning and desire to engage our will to stop it and overcome these adversarial forces.
And so, on Memorial Day, we honor those people who are no longer with us, but who decided to confront those forces and sacrifice their lives so that we could be free, but it is also a bold and deep reminder of how invaluable and fragile freedom is. And when you think about how some people are willing to sacrifice their freedoms under the idea that their lives may be saved or “pampered”, let’s never forget that life would not hold any real substantive quality under the application of such an idea, especially for a lifetime. The quality of life of an American is most significant when individuals have the power to enable their wills for the purpose of making both their lives and the lives of others as free as humanly possible and to keep that element of significant value always in your sight, maintain and build on it, and know with deep care, regard, and consideration that nothing quite like it will be offered again.
Happy Memorial Day!!!
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Post by bostondave on Jun 16, 2020 1:02:01 GMT -6
Jebus how can there be so many views and so little activity? I don't get this place.
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jun 16, 2020 2:15:45 GMT -6
Jebus how can there be so many views and so little activity? I don't get this place. Well, honestly, most people read the posts here without necessarily feeling that they have to ignite or engage in a debate. It is when something stirs someone up, or someone feels the need to contest or add something insightful to it do you see a lot of activity. It is when debates ignite, do you get more views and more activity because they A. want to see the drama unfold and B. they want to read both perspectives and see where the arguments go when there is a disagreement.
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Post by bostondave on Jun 21, 2020 20:17:52 GMT -6
That makes no damn sense. Over a hundred views and only two posts?? Something is strange here. Here let me test it. Traitor (I calls him traitor for conspiring with foreign countries against the US) is a sick individual. He's amazingly immature, surprisingly stupid, a pathological liar, a supreme narcissist, let me repeat that he's a moron and an idiot (this from people in his own cabinet), he gassed peaceful protesters for a real stupid photo-op, he's in the process of purging everyone in charge of investigating him or his cronies - perhaps the most corrupt person in that office, including Nixon. Firing investigators and Inspectors General left and right. He's mean and nasty even to mimicking handicapped people and attacking terminally sick people. This guy is a d**n human abommination and an obscenity as POTUS. It's clear he's got some level of cult following with people actually willing to sign away their lives to attend one of his dumbass rallies. This man cares nothing about America - did I call him a traitor already? He and his followers I am convinced care nothiong about America and what America is turning in to and so would rather burn it down or turn it over to Putin.
So, lets see if any of that at all will spur someone to comment one time instead of viewing over a hundred times.
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jun 21, 2020 23:05:11 GMT -6
LOL!! Two things. 1. This is a Memorial Day post, not a post to put on display how impressionable you are to the influence of fake news stories. 2. When we do talk about Trump, we will look into many positive things that his administration has done for the benefit of this country.... and there is a lot. All we get from the media is useless drama. As actor Denzel Washington said, "If you don't read the newspaper, you're uninformed. If you do read it, you're misinformed". There is a lot of strange, inane, and bizarre charges made in your post, so that shows me that you just read and believe left wing propaganda at face value. It's brazenly evident here that the corporate media in this country is not at all about reporting news, but ALL about electioneering and utilize their positions as "reporters" to be hard core activists pushing a radical left wing political agenda. It is so bad now that I feel like I need to check their work. And when I do, I find the truth of a matter that ends up exposing the lie that covers it. Your emotions are a result of this influence on the surface, not beyond it.
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Post by bostondave on Jun 25, 2020 5:24:24 GMT -6
LOL!! Two things. 1. This is a Memorial Day post, not a post to put on display how impressionable you are to the influence of fake news stories. 2. When we do talk about Trump, we will look into many positive things that his administration has done for the benefit of this country.... and there is a lot. All we get from the media is useless drama. As actor Denzel Washington said, "If you don't read the newspaper, you're uninformed. If you do read it, you're misinformed". There is a lot of strange, inane, and bizarre charges made in your post, so that shows me that you just read and believe left wing propaganda at face value. It's brazenly evident here that the corporate media in this country is not at all about reporting news, but ALL about electioneering and utilize their positions as "reporters" to be hard core activists pushing a radical left wing political agenda. It is so bad now that I feel like I need to check their work. And when I do, I find the truth of a matter that ends up exposing the lie that covers it. Your emotions are a result of this influence on the surface, not beyond it. So pick one, just one, of my "strange, inane and bizarre charges". Just one. And lets delve into it. Just one. That's not too much to ask is it? Just pick one.
**Or any one of the 186 mysterious viewers of this thread. Unless it's some trick you're doing. Or something crazier.
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jun 29, 2020 18:48:19 GMT -6
So pick one, just one, of my "strange, inane and bizarre charges". Just one. And lets delve into it. Just one. That's not too much to ask is it? Just pick one. **Or any one of the 186 mysterious viewers of this thread. Unless it's some trick you're doing. Or something crazier. Okay, for one, you said, "This man cares nothing about America - did I call him a traitor already? He and his followers I am convinced care nothiong about America and what America is turning in to and so would rather burn it down or turn it over to Putin." My take: While the people you put in office continue to sell themselves to lobbyists, corporatists, millionaires and billionaires with an agenda, getting richer off of their positions, fighting for raises for themselves, and inking elaborate deals with some shady characters, the areas that they are supposed to represent are predominantly hellholes, and they don't care. Look at San Francisco, for example, Pelosi's key constituency. It is extremely expensive to live there, and yet homelessness runs rampant, people are defacating in the streets, drug needles are found everywhere, lootings, riotings, and all sorts of degenerative behavior reigns dominant. She has been in power for over 30+ years, and this is what she has to show for it? Shoot! Donald Trump gave up a comfortable life to be slandered against, be undermined regularly, have incredible high level schemes lodged against him, and for what? For promising to fix problems in this country and actually pursuing to keep those promises? Heck, the man, unlike ALL of his detractors, donates his salary to help people and organizations in need, so while his enemies are on the take, he is always giving of himself for the sake of the country. That, to me, is caring more about America than anything I've ever seen before. And while we're on the subject of burning America down, Donald Trump or his supporters are not burning America down as are actually his Marxist communist adversaries. Marxists in Democrat controlled cities all across the country are burning their communities down. And while many of these Democrats in charge of some of these cities and states are giving the orders to police to stand down, and allow them to do what they want (while even paying some of these radicals' bail), Trump is looking to get involved and stop them and stop their destruction for the safety of all Americans. And so, you don't give up a good life to encounter this kind of hell unless you truly care so much about the country that you are willing to put yourself through that type of abuse to better the lives of those under you.
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Post by bostondave on Jul 1, 2020 4:59:41 GMT -6
OK that was a somewhat wide ranging response. But let me modify the one statement you picked out as "inane, strange and bizzare". That Traitor and his followers care nothing about America. That was a bit extreme and I'll amend it to say Traitor cares about America, but not more than he does about his own fortune and his own poitical fortunes. Regarding his followers if you support someone that's a traitor to their country that makes you a traitor to yuor country. Or they love him, as good cultists, more than they do their country.
You talked about him sacrificing himself for the country. I would submit that he is and has always looked to his personal enrichment more. Always. He refused to divest and is enriching himself at the expense of the country. That is factual. I think Bolton has stated most of his foreign policy is done with an eye on his personal holdings in places like Turkey. That can be considered speculative, but he did run for POTUS while also trying to swing a deal for a tower in Moscow.
You talk about him donating his 400k salary and donating it to organizations. It's factual that he has had problems in the past with charities. So far the only thing that he's been guilty of is finding he was using his own family charity as a slush fund for himself and his family to buy things like huge portraits. And that salary is a small percentage of what he's spent golfing.
All of that was an attempt at responding to your post, but the real issue is his playing footsie with Putin. You simply have got to have the intellectual honesty to admit there's something fishy going on between he and Putin and Russia. You simply have to. There's just so much there. From him asking Russia for help in subverting our country. Putin is a sworn enemy of America and yet he wants to be friends with him. He has taken Putin's side against America. Reports are Russia put bounties on American's heads and his response so far has been to cozy up to Putin. I could go on for paragraphs. Both House and Sentate reports agree Russia attacked us, along with Mueller, along with Pub leader McCarthy who in an unguarded moment said Putin pays Trump. THis is what I'd like for you to confront for me. Do it honesty and squarely. Attempt an explanation for his seeming love for Putin who is an enemy, or at the best an adversary, of America. I'm keenly interested in your take on this.
I didn't address what you said about burning down America. Rioting and looting is nothing compared to destroying America. And I am firmly convinced he has tapped into a sentiment of too many cons who would rather see America destroyed than to suffer through the changes they see happening to it. It's my opinion that electing a black POTUS drove them crazy. Snapped their sanity. Was the last straw so to speak and they cannot abide anymore of the changes they see happening and would rather see America destroyed.
But let's set all that other nuts aside and please make a solid attempt at explaining to me his love affair with Putin. Perhaps take a shot at the paradox of him wanting to "Make America Great" again while he is supported by someone that hates and wants to damage or destroy America. Certainly Putin doesn't want to make America great does he? Lets try to focus on what you focused on, that Traitor cares much more about himself than he does America and why he debases, genuflects and is so obeisant towards Putin.
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jul 1, 2020 18:14:49 GMT -6
OK that was a somewhat wide ranging response. But let me modify the one statement you picked out as "inane, strange and bizzare". That Traitor and his followers care nothing about America. That was a bit extreme and I'll amend it to say Traitor cares about America, but not more than he does about his own fortune and his own poitical fortunes. Regarding his followers if you support someone that's a traitor to their country that makes you a traitor to yuor country. Or they love him, as good cultists, more than they do their country. That may have been true at one point, but it is no longer. Sure, Donald Trump once spent big money to influence politicians to enrich himself further, and really what bilionaire hasn't done that? It is maddening in essence, but that is how the system accommodated them. Bill Gates not only contributes huge political contributions to Democrats, but he's pushing to have everyone vaccinated and chipped in the name of the coronavirus so that HE GETS THE CONTRACT to make it happen, which would enormously grow his fortunes through Microsoft. Warren Buffet does the same thing, yet he advocates being taxed more in front of the cameras for effect, but then continues to exploit loopholes to keep his taxes lower. George Soros is by far the one who exploits loopholes the most, pays very little in taxes, and buys so many politicians to further his business interests that they make him even more money, and are happy to do it because they get richer accommodating him! But back to Trump, when he ran for president, he forfeited a lot of his own benefits at his discretion, since, I got news for you, if he lost the election in 2016, he would be making much more money doing business than he would have ever made being president, especially if he sold out. That is something that nobody, and I mean nobody, ever thinks about. His campaign is mostly comprised of grassroots donations, and his money so that he cannot be bought. And that's what is at the foundation of their hatred for him. He lost more money being president than he gained by being president. The whole cultists thing is disingenuous. Every Trump supporter I know thinks deeper into matters than Biden supporters do. What do I mean by this? In every single interaction I encounter, people always get hyper emotional off of some story they read from The New York Times, Washington Post, CNN, Media Matters, or what have you. When you ask them on questions that trigger them to think, they don't know what to do, or don't know what to say. Then they go into rants about "you are racist" and it descends into name calling and contempt. Whenever I delve into details, I ALWAYS try to understand how things work, judge actions based on those things, and then make my conclusion. And if and when there is something that I don't know, I will try like hell to find out and understand it, and am relentless in my pursuits. I don't find that at all in Democrats today. It's just that they believe what they read and react emotionally off of that. No wonder there is such contempt towards Trump supporters. That can be considered speculative, but he did run for POTUS while also trying to swing a deal for a tower in Moscow..... All of that was an attempt at responding to your post, but the real issue is his playing footsie with Putin. You simply have got to have the intellectual honesty to admit there's something fishy going on between he and Putin and Russia. You simply have to. There's just so much there. From him asking Russia for help in subverting our country. Putin is a sworn enemy of America and yet he wants to be friends with him. He has taken Putin's side against America. Reports are Russia put bounties on American's heads and his response so far has been to cozy up to Putin. I could go on for paragraphs. Both House and Sentate reports agree Russia attacked us, along with Mueller, along with Pub leader McCarthy who in an unguarded moment said Putin pays Trump. THis is what I'd like for you to confront for me. Do it honesty and squarely. Attempt an explanation for his seeming love for Putin who is an enemy, or at the best an adversary, of America. I'm keenly interested in your take on this........But let's set all that other nuts aside and please make a solid attempt at explaining to me his love affair with Putin. Perhaps take a shot at the paradox of him wanting to "Make America Great" again while he is supported by someone that hates and wants to damage or destroy America. Certainly Putin doesn't want to make America great does he? Lets try to focus on what you focused on, that Traitor cares much more about himself than he does America and why he debases, genuflects and is so obeisant towards Putin. On the tower: We reside within a global economy, and have done so for many years, and Trump was still a businessman when he ran for president, and so it does not surprise me if he wanted to open a hotel in Moscow. Do I think there was anything nefarious that can be associated with that? No, because Putin and Russia are not going to tip the scales in someone's favor for building a hotel in his country. Plus, the more they're finding out about "Russiagate" the more illegal activity is coming to light that led to the charges and to these conspiracies. I mean the Dossier is a huge one for starters. The forged documents and underhanded means to get General Flynn out, and a whole host of persecutions that were initiated under the Russiagate narrative, are jaw dropping and frightening. Plus, there was no benefit for Putin to help Trump win the 2016 election. They would have had far better chances doing whatever they wanted with Hillary Clinton winning. Heck, she truly was for sale, and they would have been better off with her winning because she would have never imposed sanctions on them, nor would she have done anything to really challenge them in any way. She was making deals with them as Secretary of State, as was Obama when he said in 2012, that he would have more flexibility to work with them after the election than before. I remember Romney clanging the cymbals, so to speak, saying exactly what you are saying, but Obama discredited the charge saying "the 1980's are calling to ask for their foreign policy back because the Cold War has been over for 20 years", and since the media always followed the direction he wanted to go, it lost its zeal completely. That's why it has never been able to stick with anyone but the partisan party faithful, and in thinking things through in detail, Trump's actions in terms of sanctions, and other economic restrictions have hurt their country. This is something Hillary would have never done, so I still don't see the motive and intent that would have benefitted them with a Trump administration. I didn't address what you said about burning down America. Rioting and looting is nothing compared to destroying America. In their rioting and looting, they were burning buildings and creating mayhem, chaos, and disorder. That is destroying America, and that is their intention. They are self-described Marxists who admittedly seek to destroy America and its foundations, and they want Donald Trump out of the White House. Democrats just sat there, particularly the ones with Marxist sentiments, so that will be fiercely interesting as a campaign issue. It will stoke the fires of motivation because no somewhat clear thinking individual would think that that's okay, or just dismiss it as people just letting off steam. These Marxist organizations stand by waiting for something that arouses tenough passion to exploit and use as a foothold to unleash their destruction. This happened with Treyvon Martin in 2012, and with Michael Brown in 2014. This case was different because, unlike Martin and Brown, Floyd just used a counterfeit bill, and the cop grossly over-reacted to brazen extremes. I am firmly convinced he has tapped into a sentiment of too many cons who would rather see America destroyed than to suffer through the changes they see happening to it. It's my opinion that electing a black POTUS drove them crazy. Snapped their sanity. Was the last straw so to speak and they cannot abide anymore of the changes they see happening and would rather see America destroyed. Color had nothing to do with it. That innuendo was nothing more than an intimidating tactic to use if anybody opposed him. If what you were saying was true, there would have been a major stink towards Condoleeza Rice, and she was a very responsible and disciplined person. Electing a POTUS that had Marxist learnings, a history, and scores of associations with Marxists, incorporating many of them in his administrations (especially by appointing Czars in all areas of government) is what people were upset against. And the changes that he incorporated, of which hardly any supporter even knows about, left a lot of people out in the cold, or harmed them and their livelihoods in some way. When this happens, and you deliberately downsize America, you deprive people a source of income and impose restrictions that make it more difficult to live their lives. And when this happens, it turns into a ground swelling political movement that gains momentum especially when someone promises growth, and speaks to and resonates with those who were deprived in some way. Do you know how many people who were once Obama supporters became Trump supporters? Enough to win Pennsylvania, Michigan,and Wisconsin, three very Democrat controlled states. Trump has made the country stronger, and that is the choice in 2020. Give America to the minds that are leading and accommodating the rioters, or institute order and grow America. It doesn't get more clearer than that.
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Post by bostondave on Jul 2, 2020 6:40:40 GMT -6
You seem to want a wide ranging conversation covering a lot. I would prefer to focus on something that to this day I cannot believe. The lack of patriotism of cons. You plucked out one part of what I said as "inane, strange and bizzare" regarding him and his followers not caring about America. Lets bore down on that. I have no problem with those other subjects and we can delve into them perhaps at some later time but there is this matter that I'm obsessed and amazed about. Conservatives used to be the super flag waving patriots and America first boosters all of my life, up to now.
I'll just briefly touch on this matter of "cultishness" among his followers though. You mentioned something about those you encounter not being able to articulate their views. I'm here and I'm having no problems with expression or articulation. How there can be so much hardcore support for a person so reprehensible, despicable and clearly amoral in the position of POTUS cannot be explained any other way except a cult of personality. We can see this when they line up to virtually sign their lives away and absolve his rallies from any responsibility if they contract a deadly infectious disease to attend one of his rambling, disjointed and barely coherent rallies. That is again "cultish".
But regarding him and Russia. Is it the case you can discount the mountain of converging evidences of there being something very very wrong there? You have not the slightest bit of hesitation of ignoring everything we've seen and are seeing right now as I type this? Please explain this to me as clearly as you can because I cannot fathom it. Starting with him asking for Russia to come help him win an election. And please if you would attempt to explain the paradox of Putin supporting him - Putin himself said this in Helsinky, while he is also considered by virtually everyone, except Traitor perhaps, that he is an adversary of America. Does this mean Putin wants to make America great? Please attempt to fully confront that for me.
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Post by doug1943 on Jul 4, 2020 22:31:30 GMT -6
I am definitely not an admirer of Mr Trump. I would far have preferred an American Churchill -- hell, I would have preferred an American Kennedy or Nixon! But you go to war with the army you've got.
Let's look at this issue of "patriotism": it's a neutral virtue. A patriot loves his country, warts and all. This is not always a good thing! Hitler benefitted from the intense patriotism of ordinary Germans -- nearly half of whom had voted Communist or Socialist in the last free election they were allowed to have -- and so the Germans resisted the Allies long after it was obvious that they had lost the war. So we shouldn't celebrate patriotism abstractly -- as we do honesty and compassion -- but only in certain concrete instances.
People are patriotic for the same reason that they love themselves, then their immediate family, then their extended family, and so on 'outward'. There are strong Darwinian reasons for this: for most nations, patriotism -- the love of their nation -- is simply an extenstion of family-love, clan-love, tribal-love.
But America, founded by and continually peopled by immigrants of all nations, while also being made up of peoples whose ancestors became Americans involuntarily -- Native Americans, African-Americans, and those Hispanics in the area stolen from Mexico in 1845 -- this America has been different.
Because American patriotism is not based on a 'nation' ... i.e. a single tribe, an extended biological family. It is based on ... well, being an American, which means being a citizen of a nation that was founded on the premise that "All men are created equal."
Thus the only real anti-racism is American patriotism. The 'anti-racism' taught (ie. indoctinated) in the education system is only skin deep -- a conformity to current social norms. But the emotions stirred when the flag-draped coffin of an American soldier -- who could be of any race -- rolls slowly down the main street of a small American town -- those emotions are far deeper than the shallow 'anti-racism' that the Left embraces.
But the Left is not stupid. Although its core beliefs are profoundly anti-American -- which is why Howard Zinn's lying textbook has become common in our schools -- these people do know the value of pretending to be American patriots.
Thus, while they prepare to assault the memories and statues of those slaveholders, George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, they are quite willing to brazenly say "We are the true patriots."
Really ... let's see. Their real heroines are not Betsy Ross, but Jane Fonda, infamously pictured peering through the sights of a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun as she pretended to shoot down Americans overhead.
In New York City, the liberal City Council honored the Soviet spy, Ethyl Rosenberg. [https://nypost.com/2015/09/29/city-council-honors-woman-executed-for-treason-in-1953/]
These people are not patriots, but anti-patriots. It's a shame that pro-Boards do not allow the posting of images, because I would post the image of another of their heroes, Bill Ayers, standing on an American flag. That's what they really think of America.
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Post by bostondave on Jul 5, 2020 10:56:04 GMT -6
I am definitely not an admirer of Mr Trump. I would far have preferred an American Churchill -- hell, I would have preferred an American Kennedy or Nixon! But you go to war with the army you've got. Let's look at this issue of "patriotism": it's a neutral virtue. A patriot loves his country, warts and all. This is not always a good thing! Hitler benefitted from the intense patriotism of ordinary Germans -- nearly half of whom had voted Communist or Socialist in the last free election they were allowed to have -- and so the Germans resisted the Allies long after it was obvious that they had lost the war. So we shouldn't celebrate patriotism abstractly -- as we do honesty and compassion -- but only in certain concrete instances. People are patriotic for the same reason that they love themselves, then their immediate family, then their extended family, and so on 'outward'. There are strong Darwinian reasons for this: for most nations, patriotism -- the love of their nation -- is simply an extenstion of family-love, clan-love, tribal-love. But America, founded by and continually peopled by immigrants of all nations, while also being made up of peoples whose ancestors became Americans involuntarily -- Native Americans, African-Americans, and those Hispanics in the area stolen from Mexico in 1845 -- this America has been different. Because American patriotism is not based on a 'nation' ... i.e. a single tribe, an extended biological family. It is based on ... well, being an American, which means being a citizen of a nation that was founded on the premise that "All men are created equal." Thus the only real anti-racism is American patriotism. The 'anti-racism' taught (ie. indoctinated) in the education system is only skin deep -- a conformity to current social norms. But the emotions stirred when the flag-draped coffin of an American soldier -- who could be of any race -- rolls slowly down the main street of a small American town -- those emotions are far deeper than the shallow 'anti-racism' that the Left embraces. But the Left is not stupid. Although its core beliefs are profoundly anti-American -- which is why Howard Zinn's lying textbook has become common in our schools -- these people do know the value of pretending to be American patriots. Thus, while they prepare to assault the memories and statues of those slaveholders, George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, they are quite willing to brazenly say "We are the true patriots." Really ... let's see. Their real heroines are not Betsy Ross, but Jane Fonda, infamously pictured peering through the sights of a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun as she pretended to shoot down Americans overhead. In New York City, the liberal City Council honored the Soviet spy, Ethyl Rosenberg. [https://nypost.com/2015/09/29/city-council-honors-woman-executed-for-treason-in-1953/] These people are not patriots, but anti-patriots. It's a shame that pro-Boards do not allow the posting of images, because I would post the image of another of their heroes, Bill Ayers, standing on an American flag. That's what they really think of America. Not a peep about Traitor and Putin. Not even remotely touched it. Another wide ranging kind of rambling post about a lot of nothing. Let me help you out and focused. How do yhou feel about Putin placing a bounty on the heads of American soldiers in Afghanistan? How do you feel about Traitor's response to the reports?
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jul 6, 2020 20:48:20 GMT -6
I'll just briefly touch on this matter of "cultishness" among his followers though. You mentioned something about those you encounter not being able to articulate their views. I'm here and I'm having no problems with expression or articulation. How there can be so much hardcore support for a person so reprehensible, despicable and clearly amoral in the position of POTUS cannot be explained any other way except a cult of personality. We can see this when they line up to virtually sign their lives away and absolve his rallies from any responsibility if they contract a deadly infectious disease to attend one of his rambling, disjointed and barely coherent rallies. That is again "cultish".
To best undestand a Trump supporter, you have to disregard EVERYTHING that the media says about him and his supporters. Why? Because NONE of it is real or true, and it is ALL fake, manufactured, and mass produced. That said, if you are not grounded firmly in any core conviction (whether it is moral, ethical, or principle), in common sense, in a genuine love for America, and if you don't spend your available time immersed in research and seeking genuine solutions to real problems, then you will be "tossed around" a lot, and your "thinking" will be done for you as you become controlled by what they say and propagate.
That said, Barack Obama had a real "cult of personality." Why? Because everybody (the media, Hollywood, public education, academia, corporate America, and so on exalted Barack Obama with one voice and with one message. In other words, they exalted a "messianic" type figure in which everybody who supported him, projected all of their hearts desires on to him. And this machinery of all of these things worked to forward his agenda, attack his opposition, and cultivate his celebrity status to maintain political dominance over the culture. That said, if you engaged most Obama's supporters about policies (which the people did not favor, yet they loved the MAN, and never attributed the consequences of his policies to him), they would ALWAYS fall short of facts, independent thought/analysis, and detail. They would either repeat what the media was told to them, act out of a sort of love and devotion to the man (or the idea that they projected onto him), or act out of contempt and prejudice towards his detractors. Trump's "following" so to speak, is very different. For one thing, did the media make Trump? Yes they did, but only when he was a successful businessman/celebrity. When he started running for president to fix actual problems, the political machine (the media, Hollywood, public education, academia, corporate America, etc.) turned against him and made an extremely negative, conspiratorial image of him. They all spoke with one voice and with one message against him, making him look like a real piece of you know what. And that's what they've been doing ever since. Moreover, this machinery has worked feverishly to try and stop his agenda, exalt his opposition, and through censorship, selective "reporting", erroneous claims, and conspiracies, try to maintain political dominance over the culture to overpower and to overwhelm his influence to change things and get things done. And that's not counting all of the illegal actions, forgeries, abuses of power, and overstepping of government agencies in Washington D.C. going against him to try and get rid of him, eliminate Cabinet choices, and so forth. This is immensely frightening in and of itself. On top of this, when I engage Trump supporters about policies, I am always amazed at how informed they are. I mean, sure you have your idiots, but you have a lot more independent thinkers. As someone who not only uses this board, but also is involved in various other forms of social media, I am impressed by, but not surprised by what information I can get. We learn bits from each other, because when you have core convictions, common sense, a genuine love for America, and you take the time to research, you will have certain expectations from your leaders. And this is where Trump maintains his loyalty. He DOES WHAT HE SAYS HE'S GOING TO DO, and he pursues policies/solutions to problems TO FIX THEM, not to drag them out to keep his position. Look at a large portion of the career politicians in Washington D.C. They have been saying the same things for decades, and they still execute the same political tactics that they've always pushed. Why? Because they work. Do they have anything to show for it? In many cases, no, but you really have to follow politics in order to take notice of that. So in other words, unlike a real "cult of personality", which in Trump's case is NOT maintained or advanced by a collective body of the most influential cultural, political, or commercial forces, it is assembled by people who genuinely seek ideas that will benefit the country, desire solutions to problems, want to see prosperity, and want to get out of the predicaments that 8 years of Obama put them in. Bottom line; support for Trump is rooted in support, care, and regard for the country. For Him, Trump supporters appreciate his willingness, determination, and fight for the benefit of the country, not because of the man. Obama supporters can't defend his policies more than they act out of their love for HIM. I've experienced this so many times on so many occasions. With Obama supporters people love HIM, with Trump supporters, people love the country, but appreciate his conviction, his ideas, and his effort to go above and beyond expectations to solve problems for the country. When you think about it, if the media overshadowed everyone's thinking, a negative Trump image would never propel him to the presidency. It took too much independent thinking and rejection of contrived media effort to put him in office. And speaking for myself, I am happy because he Is doing things that I have wanted a president to do for a long time..... and he's catching hell for it. At any rate......
But regarding him and Russia. Is it the case you can discount the mountain of converging evidences of there being something very very wrong there? You have not the slightest bit of hesitation of ignoring everything we've seen and are seeing right now as I type this? Please explain this to me as clearly as you can because I cannot fathom it. Starting with him asking for Russia to come help him win an election. And please if you would attempt to explain the paradox of Putin supporting him - Putin himself said this in Helsinky, while he is also considered by virtually everyone, except Traitor perhaps, that he is an adversary of America. Does this mean Putin wants to make America great? Please attempt to fully confront that for me.
This Russia conspiracy narrative is just that, a conspiracy. We have a relativist media in America that has an unbridled tendency to shift all too often to further the agenda that they are trying to promote for the moment. What does that mean? It means that what might be "right" to them one day might be "wrong" for them the next. That said, when Obama decided to make deals with Putin, and Republicans criticized him for it, the media reacted to Obama's relationship with Putin positively. When they tried to associated Putin with Trump, then Putin was all of a sudden "the bad guy" and the media and the Democrats started sounding the alarms. So I have not been able to take it seriously. On top of that, if something serious did come out in regards to a genuine conviction, I would seriously seek answers, but in all of the time that "Russiagate" has gone on, it has only been taken seriously by partisan Democrats, and it has not crossed over into any other serious territory from there. It just hasn't. Take this into consideration; whenever something is ignored by people unwilling to believe it, it will most definitely cross over into the mainstream. Issues that the media deliberately suppressed regarding Obama were forced to be addressed in debate forums, and in some media outlets after it was talked about and brought out for the first time unfiltered through those forums. The same would apply here. So, if something serious comes out, it will be incorporated in the upcoming debates.
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Post by bostondave on Jul 7, 2020 12:51:43 GMT -6
There is no media creation. He is noxious, despicable, reprehensible. He shows this in the open. Kindly in your next post address him mimicking a handicapped person, him punching down on McCain while terminal, him calling people names, his various policies like separating kids from mothers at the border, his girl thingy grabbing. None of that is false media. He did all of it in the open for everyone to see. You think you could directly address those clear indications of someone that is a reprehensible human being? Take each point one at a time if you would please.
If Putin supports and favors Traitor, which said out of his own mouth in Helsinky, does that mean Putin wants to make America great? Can you please address points squarely? And are you the least bit curious about Russia putting bounties on Ameican's soldiers heads? At least want to investigate and get to the bottom of it? Again, can you make attempts at squarely confronting the questions I put to you? There are two points I've made here, can you address them both please?
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Post by Rob W. Case on Jul 7, 2020 14:52:44 GMT -6
There is no media creation. He is noxious, despicable, reprehensible. He shows this in the open. Kindly in your next post address him mimicking a handicapped person, him punching down on McCain while terminal, him calling people names, his various policies like separating kids from mothers at the border, his girl thingy grabbing. None of that is false media. He did all of it in the open for everyone to see. You think you could directly address those clear indications of someone that is a reprehensible human being? Take each point one at a time if you would please.
Don't you think you're being a bit thin skinned for someone who follows a party that embraces and promotes sexual deviance and debauchery in every form? The Access Hollywood tape was not a problem in Hollywood at all when it occurred. Trump was a Hollywood celebrity at the time and a critic of President Bush. So, nothing to see or care about there. If it were a serious issue on substantiative grounds, it wouldn't have taken 11 years for it to come out when he became a formidable presidential candidate, and stir up outrage. When you talk about Serge Kovaleski, the media assumes that Trump was making fun of his disability. No, Trump has made similar hand movements and gestures when he sarcastically does impersonations of people. He made the same movements (with the arms flailing around, and sounding ldiotic) when making fun of himself in 2005, bank regulators in general, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, The Washington Post, and George Stephanopolous. It was when he sarcastically protrayed Serge Kovaleski, whom he read in the New York Times, and mocked in a sarcastic way, for going back on something he reported at an earlier time. But because he had a disability, it was manufactured by the media as though Trump was making fun of his disability. Of course, that did not look good, so when I checked this out, it turns out he made the same mannerisms and gestures in other speeches when he was sarcastically protraying them. Because the media is riddled profusely with activists, I expect them to be political, and to try and make things political even if they have to make it up. And sadly, when it does, it is of no surprise to me. That's why I feel like I have to check these things out.
If Putin supports and favors Traitor, which said out of his own mouth in Helsinky, does that mean Putin wants to make America great? Can you please address points squarely? And are you the least bit curious about Russia putting bounties on Ameican's soldiers heads? At least want to investigate and get to the bottom of it? Again, can you make attempts at squarely confronting the questions I put to you? There are two points I've made here, can you address them both please?
I never heard Putin endorse Trump for a 2nd term. I'm proof positive that if he did do that, you would hear nothing but that everywhere. I heard that Russia putting bounty payments on soldiers heads started out as a leak from "an anonymous source" to the New York Times. As to the substance of it, its too early to tell. Russia is denying it, the people who tried to assemble Russiagate are sounding the alarms, so while there is high skepticism concerning its credibility, there is also an ear out interested in details.
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